Intro 0:00
Welcome to the Naturally Healthy Pets podcast. Let's get to it.
Dr. Judy Morgan
Hello and welcome to the Naturally Healthy Pets podcast. I'm your host, Dr Judy Morgan. My guest today is Dr Tsakiris, and she owns Naturopawthic great name, Veterinary Wellness Center in Red Bank, New Jersey. She's an expert in the field of Holistic Veterinary Medicine, and is passionate about changing the paradigm of veterinary medicine to one where all practices are integrated. Boy, would that be nice with the corporate takeover? You know, I don't, I don't know who we got to talk to to convince corporate to do that. But anyway, so she got her veterinary degree at the Royal Veterinary College in London in 2005 and studied acupuncture at the Chi Institute in 2009. She is a fellow in the Veterinary Botanical Medical Association, great group of people, and is an expert in using herbs to treat our patients. And today, we want to talk about the herbal piece of the behavior puzzle. This is, this is actually so cool, because I absolutely hate behavior cases. I'm gonna be upfront about that. I when people would call me and say, I want to come in for a behavioral consultation, and I want you to treat my animal holistically. We need to solve this problem. I would like cringe and run the other way and say, Can we find somebody else? So I think it's very Do you have a special interest in behavior?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 1:28
I do. I do. Neurodiversity has come down, like, really intensely in my life, and I feel like because of that, I've started to really attract behavior cases. And so I just, I kind of love the challenge of it as well. And I also feel bad because no one can get into actually see a behaviorist at this point.
Dr. Judy Morgan
Well, that is true too.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris
So they need, they need at least some sort of foundation to get started with,
Dr. Judy Morgan 1:55
yeah, and you know, part of the problem and using herbs and acupuncture is like, so cool for behavior, because when we look at things from a Chinese medicine perspective, we know we can have a Shen disturbance. We know that liver Qi stagnation can can rise up and cause anger and frustration,
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris
all the liver heat, all the things happen,
Dr. Judy Morgan
yeah. So you know, from that perspective, I was always like, okay, cool. I got this. I Yep, can do that. I can. And then you get these cases that they just are so embedded, so ingrained. And you know, unfortunately, we have that human factor where the owners literally do everything wrong and play into the behavior I mean, usually the behavior problems are caused by us. I know that my my dogs with behavior problems. Hello, yeah, mom didn't train. Mom doesn't know how to train but and I have a I have a COVID child. He literally never left my house, never saw anybody but us for a year, and he's awful when strangers come in the house. Just awful. So I admit, you know, we have to take responsibility as well,
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 3:13
totally, absolutely. We all play our part, right and like, we have to manage our expectations too, of what, what can we do moving forward?
Dr. Judy Morgan 3:22
Exactly! So the, you know, part of the problem in traditional medicine, we would just reach for a pharmaceutical for this, philosophy. But, you know, and the problem is there are a lot of different behavior medications to choose from. so, you know, when I would look at it, I was like, I don't even know which one to choose for this particular problem. So for me, it was always just a huge frustration. And of course, if you have an animal who's being aggressive and you know, they're dangerous, like I used to have some clients with really dangerous, aggressive dogs that were very unpredictable, and these owners were so committed to these dogs, and I had to give them a lot of credit for being committed and wanting, you know, working with trainers, working with behaviors. But for me, I was always like, Oh my gosh, this is a huge, dangerous, unpredictable dog
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 4:17
so that is, that's where, like, it's managing what, what can we do? Right? And how, you know, where do we start? Let's,
Dr. Judy Morgan 4:26
where do we start?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 4:26
Where do we start? I always start everywhere. I mean, I know we're here to talk about herbs. I always start with diet. Diet change is huge, so we have to think. I always tell people like, think about kids with ADHD. People with ADHD, are you going to feed them a bunch of carbs and sugar? What's going to happen, right? Like, they're going to go bonkers. So if we're feeding a high processed diet that's chock full of carbs, probably not the best thing there, right? And like,
Dr. Judy Morgan 4:54
when my kids were in school, there was a little boy in my son's class, and he had the worst ADHD. And he was, you know, he was so disruptive. It was a private school, small classrooms, so you would think, you know, here's the school is like, oh, you know, we vet the kids. We make sure that there's not going to be any disruptive behavior. And we had this one child who was just a mess, and all of a sudden he started being wonderful. And so I was talking to his mom one day, I said, What did you do? And she said, we discovered that red dyes in food make him crazy, and so they totally changed the kid's diet. And as long as he didn't get anything with red dyes, he was the model citizen. And so, you know, this was long before I was into holistic medicine or holistic anything, and to me that was just like, Oh my gosh.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 5:42
It's an eye opener. Yeah,
Dr. Judy Morgan 5:45
it is like, we don't realize how many chemicals we're exposed to and the effects that they have on our bodies and on our pets' bodies, exactly. We always have to start with diet. You're absolutely right
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 5:56
So it's starting. And, like you said, starting a diet for many reasons, right, like, right? Is there something that they're just intolerant to, that's creating this as well?
Dr. Judy Morgan 6:06
And we also know that the microbiome, the gut brain axis, a huge interplay, yeah, with how these animals are acting. So if we've got so, I know we're going to get to the whole herb thing, so for an animal, so we're going to change the diet. But would you use some sort of herbal protocol or something for leaky gut, for these guys?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 6:29
Right? Because we know 80% of serotonin is made in the gut. I know there's all the controversy over, like, do we actually absorb it? But either way, we know that if you eat something that you don't feel well, then like your mood is not going to be great, right? So we also know serotonin is made in the gut. So I absolutely always, always address gut health. I'm addressing gut health. You know, we're looking to heal the gut. How can we actually absorb our nutrients properly? What's the microbiome like, do we do a probiotic now? Do we do a probiotic later? What's the stool quality? And then we, you know, it's this thing of, like, here's not the magic pill or the magic herb, because, again, it's a puzzle, right? So it's our livers are being bombarded. I say our because, you know, everybody's are. But like you were saying, there's all these chemicals in the air, in the water, and so if, like in Chinese medicine, we have an angry liver, we have liver Qi stagnation, kind of translated Western as well as Can we just support our organs of elimination so that we're helping those as well? So it's in my protocol of beginning, I'll go back to the first question. Is, yes, I always want to address the gut and gut health, because it is really of utmost importance. Otherwise, you're on this hamster wheel and you're just like chasing the problem. And so if we can't create a solid foundation,
Dr. Judy Morgan 7:57
so do you do microbiome testing on them?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 8:02
Sometimes I do. I have a few patients who have done it. I have other patients where there's certain studies out there looking at XYZ different bacterial species. And so there's a few different formulations that I'll use in those patients if they don't want to do the microbiome test. And then also just thinking about, there's certain herbs that are going to help with biofilm in the gut. And so how can we start to break up biofilm, even before we're starting to add in good bacteria? Let's start to get rid of the excess amount of the ones that we really don't need right now.
Dr. Judy Morgan 8:44
Very cool. Do you do fecal transplants?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 8:46
I don't. I keep saying that I'm going to because, I mean, it just the research. I mean, you've read the research where it's fascinating, where you can just do a fecal transplant, and you take an aggressive dog, and suddenly they're super chill. It, you know, it's just like, it's amazing. So it's definitely, definitely a possibility, but it's finding the right donor. I don't, I don't want to do a fecal transplant just willy nilly because of that.
Dr. Judy Morgan 9:16
Yeah, yeah. I mean, we're, we're lucky now because at one company in particular, Legacybiome, they they are using stool for the fecal transplant capsules from raw fed, unvaccinated dogs, which that is, you know, that's part of the problem that we've had with companies that are making fecal transplant capsules In the past, it's like, well, I have a raw fed unvaccinated dog. I don't really want the microbiome of a kibble fed vaccinated dog,
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 9:49
because we know that's gonna affect the immune system of the host that's gonna get it. So I agree, and that's why I haven't I have my own dog. She could be. A donor, but like her mother, she has a little bit of an anxiety issue, and so I don't want to pass that along to anybody.
Dr. Judy Morgan 10:08
Yeah, we're trying to fix that, right? Yeah, I don't. None of mine could be used
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 10:16
again, like managing my expectations. I know who she is, and so, like, if someone's willing to risk it, then let's give it a try.
Dr. Judy Morgan 10:24
What kind of dog do you have?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 10:26
She's a cattle dog, pit bull mix.
Dr. Judy Morgan 10:30
Well, the cattle dogs, they're, they're like, high so it's so high anxiety.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 10:35
She's got the pit bull chill. But then she's, well, she has the pit bull scream when she gives other dogs in excitement. So that's where I'm like, she's just socially awkward. She doesn't know how to like, make friends because she just screaming.
Dr. Judy Morgan 10:47
My COVID child, you know, yeah, he's fine with my other dogs. But yeah, oh my gosh, yeah.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 10:53
Making new friends. We start real slow and steady.
Dr. Judy Morgan 10:57
Yeah, yeah. Making new friends. Mine are Like, they don't know how to play with with other dogs. So they they just get stupid. I feel sorry for visitors,
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 11:07
right? I know, no. I mean, she's great with people. So I'm like, we're good. We're good.
Dr. Judy Morgan 11:14
So do you have, you know, if you have a dog with separation anxiety, so we're gonna fix the, you know, we're gonna make sure that we're eating an appropriate diet from, you know, energetically, look at TCVM characteristics and liver chi stagnation, whatever. But do you have like, Okay, I've got a dog with separation anxiety. These are my usual go to herbs. Or I've got this dog with fear aggression. These are my usual go to herbs. Do you have or do you separate your herbs sort of into categories? Or is it really just kind of a one size? It's so individualized?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 11:55
Yeah, so like it? No, I'll be honest with you. I've tried, I've really tried to sit down and one look at research of what are we seeing being studied herbally in different human as well as animal. And is there, like I was saying before, like there's certain probiotics that are better at helping with anxiety, whatever it is, but I tend to really fall back on on my TCM diagnosing so that I can say, Okay, is there heat? Do you need cooling off? Let's make sure we're using herbs that are cooling if there's a big GI component, then I want to be using herbs that we know are nerving, so like to calm them down. But also herbs that are like are anti spasmodic, anti inflammatory for the gut, right? So, like, you can't go wrong with chamomile ever, I feel like because it's beautiful, it's a digestive bitter. It's really nice and anti inflammatory for the GI but it's also a nice calming nerving so it's looking at herbs that are addressing the full picture of the patients, is what I try to do as often as possible. And sometimes, if I'm stuck, I'm like, okay, these are my favorite ones. Let's start here.
Dr. Judy Morgan 13:13
It's a good starting point. All right, we need to take a break to hear from our sponsor. We will be right back in just a few minutes. Stay tuned.
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Dr. Judy Morgan 14:35
Welcome back. You're listening to the Naturally Healthy Pets podcast, and I'm your host. Dr Judy Morgan. My guest today, Dr Tsakiris of Naturopawthic Veterinary Wellness Center in Red Bank, New Jersey, is an herbal specialist, and we are discussing the use of herbs for behavior issues. And this is so important because in traditional veterinary medicine, these animals with behavior problems, whether it's a cat or. A dog, we tend to think we're focusing on dogs a lot of the time, but I have a lot of cats, and I know that we can have spraying and urinary issues in the house. We can have inner cat aggression, where we get that wild screaming in the middle of the night when they're having a disagreement. So in traditional medicine, these animals would be put on some sort of a behavior modifying medication, and unfortunately, they can have incredible side effects. They can have these animals be very sedated, and sometimes they actually have a paradoxical effect, where they cause more excitement. They can cause tremors, all kinds of different problems that we can see in our animals. So to me, I mean, with an herbal choice, we still could have something that one is not very effective, or two, is the wrong choice, which this is where I think the TCVM becomes really critical, because I had a young veterinarian in her first year who had studied at the Chi Institute, did acupuncture and a little bit of herbal therapy, but she chose a cooling formula for a dog that was already cold, and it was for a dog who was weak in the hind end. Well, what happened is the dog just got weaker in the hind end. And when I saw the dog a few weeks later, the owners were like, something is wrong. This seems to be getting worse instead of better. I thought those herbs would fix it, and then when I looked at it, I went, oopsie.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 16:32
It's a little modifying. Little modified. Okay,
Dr. Judy Morgan 16:34
it was really crazy too, right? Exactly. So we changed it around. We went with a yong tonic, and within three weeks, this dog was up running around. And it's really cool to see that. So so I think, you know, having your acupuncture training along with the herbal training, I would think even if you're using Western herbs...
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 16:58
oh yeah, because Western herbs, they're all plant. They all have energetics. And so Western herbs, there's, there's a few, a few herbalists who've actually looked at the Western herbs, classified them hot, cold, neutral, damp. So I still can apply them to my TCM diagnosis, which is great. And then sometimes it's, I know that this plant tends to work for this and so this is what we're gonna do.
Dr. Judy Morgan 17:29
So have you, I don't, are there? Are there books out there? I mean, I know there's individual studies, but are there? Has anyone written an herbal book from a behavior perspective, where it's like, if you know, for the for people like me who are like, I hate behavior stuff, I just don't want to deal with this.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 17:48
Right. I just need, I just need a cookbook to look at.
Dr. Judy Morgan 17:50
I need a cookbook that says, well, for for this sort of anxiety, here might be a good starting point. Is there anything out there like that?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 17:59
As far as I'm aware, no, I'm trying to think,
Dr. Judy Morgan 18:04
Okay, well, here's, here's your next job.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 18:06
Here we go. Here we go. My summer, my summer writing. Forget summer reading list. It's my summer writing.
Dr. Judy Morgan 18:12
There you go. Just start. Put putting them down on paper, put them together, you know, give it to us as a, you know, ebook, download, or whatever, it would be great, because I think there's, it's, I think behavior is frustrating for a lot of veterinarians. It's not something that we spend a lot of time on in school, other than here give them Prozac.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 18:35
Yeah, exactly. And the problem is, is that, like you were saying, and listen, sometimes you need the conventional drug to get things under control. But unfortunately, I see a lot of patients who come in on some sort of pharmaceutical and it's doing nothing. And so then it's like, why are we giving a drug that's going to have potential side effects if it's not doing if there's no benefit there? So again, let's like, start at the foundation and start building and exactly looking at all the pieces to the puzzle. Here,
Dr. Judy Morgan 19:06
do you use Flower Essences in your practice?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 19:09
I do. I've had some like amazing, amazing results. So what I'll actually do is sometimes I'll either put Flower Essences in the tinctures that I make and so then we love, we love, just like coming over to our flower essences section, and just like, and it's, it's nice, because you can be very individual, of, okay, let's face your fears. Let's be confident. Or maybe you don't need to be that confident, right? Like you can, you can play with it. I'll also play with adding CBD or CBG in at a lower dose, because again, we're getting this beautiful symphony effect of nothing. So I will use it separately as well in higher doses, but sometimes just that little bit of a harmony in the formula is really, really helpful with the endocannabinoids. So I will. I'll put a few different things in there with my herbs,
Dr. Judy Morgan 20:04
that's, that's the beauty of holistic medicine. You have so many tools that you can work with. And it's really funny my my COVID, child, dog, who's now three, you should never get another dog for your dog, except I did. I got my dog, a dog. It was the best thing I ever did. They're two days apart in age. We got the second one just within the last year. They're two days apart in age. They're the same size, and they wrestle and play all the time. But their problem is that the two of them gang up on one of the other dogs, right? The other dog is three times their size, but they gang up on him, and he's just like, you know, right, backs off. But I did start them on flower essences, and as long as, and I use a company that has great names, because it's easy for me to figure out exactly, exactly. So they're on, devil be gone, because that's for those who are willfully wishing harm on others, they do and mellow out to just like chill the edge, yeah, and let me tell you, as long as that is in their food twice a day, they're so good and they don't bother the other dog. And if I get lazy and I don't put it in for a day you see the poor Oh, it is amazing to me. It's amazing. Years ago, I had two Dobermans and a Rottweiler, and I they, Oh my gosh. They were so jealous of each other. They would play and get along really well, and then, and then they would try to kill each other, yeah. So I got them sibling rivalry, and as long as they had their sibling rivalry, they were good. They were angels, absolutely. Yeah. So actually, one of my clients, I was telling her about it, and she's like, can I get that for my kids? Oh, yeah, before that's for sure.
Dr. Judy Morgan 21:58
So, yeah, this is really cool. Way. And, you know, really, flower essences are basically very dilute herbs.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 22:05
Yeah. I mean, if you've ever made them, it's so cool. It's just, and it is, it's the whole energetics, but it's like, for people who are saying, Oh, it's Woo, woo, when you really get down to quantum physics, because I have a niece who's studying at Princeton, getting her PhD in quantum physics and like, there's legit you can, you can explain this stuff with science. I can't explain it to you, but she would be able to explain it. So it's even though you're putting the flower in water, in the moonlight, and collecting it in some other water, and then putting it in alcohol. It works. It does. It really works.
Dr. Judy Morgan 22:44
You know, this is one of those things when you when you go to the other side and you go to holistic medicine, you'll find, you know, one thing that you love, like for me, it's food so food therapy is always my you know, we're starting here, but there's just so many things that you can you can just start going down different paths. Yes, saying, Oh, this works. I'm going to add this in. Oh, this works. I'm going to add this in. So I'm assuming those are all herbal tinctures and powders and capsules and things behind you.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 23:17
Yes, I have a giant wall of it. I should, like, I step forward so you can see the whole thing,
Dr. Judy Morgan 23:21
and it sounds like you're making your own.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 23:24
I'm so no, I mean these I buy. I do buy them. I do make some at home, but the ones that I make at home, I tend to keep for at home and to play with. I can't make enough to keep up. I would love to. I sometimes I joke that I'm starting marshmallow farm at my house, because I'm growing so much marshmallow that like that I will. I can dry the leaves, I can dry the roots, I can make tinctures. But otherwise, I'm, I'm honestly buying it, because I just, I have another full time job, it turns out,
Dr. Judy Morgan 23:55
yeah, so, well, you never know what the future holds. So you know when you when you get burned out. That might be job number two. So like, if you have an animal that's coming in that you so are those tinctures behind you? Are they individual herbs, or a lot of or some of them combinations of things?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 24:14
No, I think. No, I have everything as individual. My Chinese herbal formulas. I have formulas. I also have some individual but no, because I'm truly like, I love being able to craft the formula to fit my patients specifically. So if I have someone coming in where there's anxiety, but then they're also getting bloody diarrhea with stress, then I can pivot in turn, and I'm using herbs like catnip for the gut, in addition to some calendula and maybe passion flower, you know, just looking at herbs Schisandra, that are going to fit that patient, I get really specific about. What I want. It's so much fun. And then we can mix it and and then you go from there, and I always say you need at least two weeks on the full dose. And again, as we know, like with people, where sometimes I have one, I have one patient who he's a German Shepherd, he can handle four drops of something, whereas normally I'd be like, take four MLS, but four drops, that's his jam, and it works for him. And so I always have people start low. We work up. I don't ever want to ruin food. I want everything in a treat and and we I always start them again, like I send them home with a small bottle. Let's make sure everybody we're getting compliance, because, I don't know, maybe waving it over their head could be helpful. But I'm not going to, I'm not going to say that is,
Dr. Judy Morgan 25:50
yeah, pretty, pretty sure we actually have to get it,
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 25:52
yeah, I've got to get it inside the animal, not just like sleeping with a book under the pillow, to get it osmotically, same thing. I tried
Dr. Judy Morgan 26:00
Yeah. Listen, that would work.
Dr. Judy Morgan 26:04
I think our animals would have much better dental health if we could just put the dental products next to them and not actually have to do anything for them. Well, that is really cool, and I love that you can, you know, just really personalize it for each animal that's having problems. How many behavior cases do you normally see in your normal work week? Is that something that's big in your practice? And are other people send sending things to you and going, I don't want to deal with this.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 26:34
I do. I do have a few local vet friends who are like, I don't know. Go see Alexia. Like, we don't know what else to do with you. Just go. Let's see if she can come up with anything. And then I do. I have some owners who refer to me, and, you know, things come in waves. And so it'll be a week of my dog has anxiety, my dog's aggressive, my dog just what. My dog won't stop barking, and then we get like, a lull. So I have at least 15 in the practice right now of coming in for, I mean, and obviously they come in for their behavior stuff, and I'm addressing everything else. So there might be some more things involved.
Dr. Judy Morgan 27:18
So with these behavior cases that you're using the herbs, do you find that they get cured? Or is this something you have to deal with forever?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 27:29
Yeah, I don't ever use the word cured, because if you look at us as humans, I mean neuro neuro divergence is recognized across the board. Now we use dogs as our test models for human ADHD things. So we're not talking about like, if someone's depressed, like I feel like Cure is a really big word, because it's part of it is how you're wired. Part of it is your environment, your food, your exercise, your socialization, right? So it's, it's managing things, because I'm not, like, I would love to say, You're cured, but what's that I just I can't.
Dr. Judy Morgan 28:11
Are they staying? Are they needing to stay on these herbs long term?
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 28:15
So I have no. I mean, there's some that they'll stay on, like a low maintenance dose. And then they'll have their herbs for situations that their owners know might set them off. And so we'll get those on board beforehand, if possible. But like, let's say walks are a trigger. Like I had one dog who he was, this German Short Hair pointer. He would not go for walks. He was petrified to go for a walk. And I was like, You should probably take him to a field and he'll chase a bird, but petrified to go for walks. And so at home, he was great, but for walks. So there were herbs that we like. When they were mentally prepared to take the next step and try to go for a walk, they would give some extra herbs to help his bravery. Probably some flower essences were in there too, right? Just get him out there. And then there's others where, because the thing is, is it's about rewiring the brain, as well as balancing everything else out. And so if they can go out and learn that, oh, wait, I can go for a walk and a scary truck isn't going to kill me. The dog across the street isn't going to come after me. Then they re they're able to rewire so I always want to take that edge off so things can get rewired and they can relearn to the best of their ability.
Dr. Judy Morgan 29:35
Yeah, yeah, you can rewire them. My, my ADD COVID. Child would not go for walks. I would put him on a leash, and he literally would just plaster himself on my driveway. He wouldn't even walk at home. I took him to puppy training class at two years of age, and now he's the best Walker we have. It just he had to get in that environment with a few other dogs and see other dogs doing it. And. He's, now he's, he's, he's so good to walk. He loves to go for walks. So we can make differences. Sometimes we need herbal flower essence, whatever help, and occasionally drugs, but we try to avoid them. This is very cool, and I'm glad there's people like you out there who really like behaviors.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 30:17
I do. It's like this great challenge.
Dr. Judy Morgan 30:21
So for anybody who wants more information, Her website is www.naturopawthicvet.com I can't say that fast. And then there's also www.zoabotanicals.com, Z, O if you use the code DRJUDY you can get 15% off your first purchase on www.zoabotanicals.com, which are veterinary, formulated herbal products. So lots of information there. And then. She's also on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, so she's got great blogs. I was looking at them earlier. So check out Dr. Tsakiris. I think this is very cool. I love the wall of herbs and tinctures behind you and congratulations going to Rutgers. Rutgers grads here.
Dr. Judy Morgan 31:10
Thank you very much for your time.
Dr. Alexia Tsakiris 31:11
Thank you for having me. This has been great. I appreciate it.
Outro
Thanks for listening to another great Naturally Healthy Pets episode. Be sure to check out the show notes for some helpful links. And if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. We value your feedback and we'd love to hear from you on how we're doing. Visit DrJudyMorgan.com for healthy product recommendations, comprehensive courses, upcoming events and other fantastic resources. Until next time, keep giving your pet the vibrant life they deserve.
DISCLAIMER
The purpose of this podcast is to educate and to inform. It is no substitute for professional care by a veterinarian, licensed nutritionist or other qualified professional. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. Dr. Judy and her guests express their own views, experience and conclusions. Dr. Judy Morgan's Naturally Healthy Pets neither endorses or opposes any particular view discussed here.
